Hello and welcome to another Interview From Behind The Universe
by Nicholas Brown
Today we are joined by freelancer extraordinaire, Ron Zalme all the way from Earth-1982!
He’s been illustrating all over, from advertising to science books, even a great How To Draw Pokemon book back in the 90s when thankfully there were only a 151 of them.
He has kindly lent us some time today for a glimpse into the Marvel commuter lifestyle and how the place can really open doors in the industry.
Q: What did you do before working at Marvel Comics and do you think that helped prepare you for the job?
I attended Upsala College, a small liberal arts college, after high school… and though I entered as a Biology Major, I needed to take a life-drawing class to fulfill a credit… that was when I realized that I would rather pursue my natural talents as an artist, so I quickly switched to an Art Major! I was very fortunate that Joe Kubert opened his cartooning school in Dover, NJ the September after I graduated. Joe reviewed my portfolio and accepted me into his first year of students. So, another switch… from “fine” arts, to commercial art.
Although I consider “on-the-job” training at Marvel to have been the most valuable, I have to give a lot of credit to Joe and the instructors he chose. Since they were all working professionals in the industry, they were spot on with their first-hand knowledge, insight, and advice. I probably have Kelly Harris and Hy Eisman to thank most of all for my job at Marvel… my cartoon talents were still developing, but Kelly taught a course specific to comic book production, and Hy taught comic style hand-lettering. It was those skills that Marie Severin [legendary creative talent working in the Bullpen and often charged with reviewing applicants], Lenny Grow [Bullpen Production Manager], and Dan Crespi [Art Director, working with Lenny] noticed and valued the most for the position in the bullpen that was soon to open, when Nel Yomtov [former Bullpenner moved to Licensing, later Editor] vacated it in July ’78.
Q: What has life been like after Marvel?
Pretty amazing. Marvel gave me a great head start and taught me so much. I started freelancing for Crazy Magazine after my first month on staff… and then for Scholastic right after! I may not be a household name, or have a fan-base, or a known property… but my career snowballed from the beginning… and I’ve never lacked for work. Though I never heavily advertised, or relied on an agent, I got passed along from one Art Director to another… all across the publishing and marketing industry of NYC… and then later, Atlanta and Chicago too. My penchant for being able to do licensed-characters brought me a LOT of business. Children’s Television Workshop, King Features, Avon Products, Marvel Family Publishing, Welsh Publishing, McClanahan, Macmillan, Simon & Schuster, Random House, Kellogg’s, Highlights for Children… the list goes on and on… and most of those relationships lasted years… with Art Directors often taking me along when they switched jobs! To be honest, I can’t explain any of it. I bought houses, raised kids, took care of all my family’s needs… and the work was always there, just as I needed it, to pay for it all. It’s stupefying. Even now, I’m semi-retired… but I still have two monthly gigs for Highlights that are still fun… and supportive. And best of all… lately, I’ve had the time to self-publish books of my own creation… several children’s books, a graphic novel, and even a sci-fi fantasy novel.
Q: Do you have any stories from the Bullpen that you’d like to tell? Perhaps something Eliot has overlooked in his writings or that you’d like to add to.
Unfortunately, I was a true “commuter” employee… I lived in the boonies of NJ and traveled over five hours a day, round-trip by train or bus, to be in the office each day. Some of the best times often occurred after hours… and so I seldom got the chance to pal around… to be friends as well as workmates. Most of the Marvel staff were also single… and I was married. A bit of a divide there as well.
I can, however, reveal a few of the fantastic things that made Marvel such a great work environment… that I don’t think anyone else has really mentioned much.
- The Bullpen wall: The outside of Dan Crespi’s office was a free-format message board where all employees could post jokes, jobs, gripes, announcements, for sale items, etc… it was the precursor to Craigslist.
- The Marvel softball team: I still have my official Marvel ball-cap! Who knew you could play softball in NYC? But we did… in an “official” publisher’s league too. We played in the “Sheep’s Meadow,” side-by-side, back-to-back, ten teams in all. I played center field… and standing next to me, facing the other way, was the outfielder from another team playing behind us!
- Lunchtime volleyball: Mark Gruenwald put together a volleyball squad that would play in Central Park (we were even once photographed for the news as a sign that spring was on the way… chilly March temps did not discourage us!) Later, when Marvel moved to Park Ave., Mark and I devised a system of stakes and ropes to define the court borders and we set up our net in Madison Square Park. When the boss, Jim Shooter played, we often played well over our allotted hour!
- Random pizza parties: Because it was… Tuesday? Occasionally, without warning, Jim Shooter would announce a sudden halt to work and stacks of pizzas would be delivered to the offices. For some parties, especially around holidays, we’d move the art tables out of the way and dance to the tunes of thrown-together rock bands of artists, writers, and editors that also played musical instruments. So many multi-talented folks!
- Respect: Almost everyone at Marvel had talent of one kind or another… and they were respected for it and encouraged. We worked very hard when it was called for and worked very well together as a team… so, we were also allowed to relax somewhat when the “hot” projects were completed. It was a very friendly work environment… and instead of stifling creativity for productivity, it promoted it. It’s the reason, I believe, that so many of Marvel’s’ top talents started out as secretaries, interns, mail clerks, bullpenners, assistants, etc. I hope that hasn’t changed.
Q: What got you to get into the comic industry in the first place?
I was an avid comic book reader as a kid… and loved to draw just about anything… but I never thought there could be an actual career involved. I had no knowledge of how comic books or syndicated comics were done. I’d given up reading them by my early teens. Later, in college, I stopped by a local shop for a coffee and discovered Will Eisner’s Spirit comic magazines! I picked up a bunch… and loved them! There was something so loose and engaging about his style… like a Mad Magazine art style, but telling a serious adventure tale. It intrigued me to revisit looking at comics of all types… Kitchen and Crumb, Gahan Wilson, Jack Davis, Frazetta… So, when the Kubert School of Cartoon opened just as I graduated college, the timing was perfect and I was thrilled.
Technically, what “got me into the industry”, was a suggestion by a classmate, in the spring before our Kubert graduation, that I go see Marie Severin at Marvel… they were looking for colorists. I met Marie a couple of times and submitted coloring samples for her feedback… and then , out of the blue, Dan Crespi called me about an opening in the bullpen.
Q: What are your experiences on the convention scene? Either as a professional or attending for fun.
Very little! I never attended any of the major conventions while at Marvel. Shooter had once had the idea to take all the bullpenners to San Diego… but that never developed, at least not in my time there. After Marvel, I attended a few smaller conventions as an attendee… but honestly, I found them to be too noisy, crowded, and fan-oriented, with little to offer me. I personally found the licensing shows and annual New York Toy Fair to be more entertaining… and lucrative! I would attend and hand out professionally printed promo cards of my work… and it often paid off with actual jobs.
Q: How has your own work in the industry changed with the rise of computer and digital techniques?
Hugely! I recognized in the late 90’s, that digital art files were going to be the future… but I had taken the IBM route with PC’s… not Macs. It was when Photoshop went “cross-platform” that I jumped in head-first! To this day, I still do my sketching and inking at my drawing board (that Lenny Grow gave to me when I started at Marvel) and then I scan in my inks to be colored in Photoshop. I haven’t touched my airbrush in twenty years! Of course, I no longer have to messenger or FedEx actual art to a publisher either, as it’s now all done with FTP over the net.
Q: What was the most fun you had working on a project at Marvel?
I guess Weirdworld? I was still pretty new at Marvel… and this massive project, overseen by Rick Marschall, threw the whole place into a whirlwind. An Australian, Peter Ledger, was often sitting in a cluttered hallway, (not enough office space!), hand-painting and airbrushing pages… and he was quite an energetic and colorful character to boot! John Buscema’s pencils were astounding! His package of the latest pages would arrive and all the work in the office stopped so the staff could “Ooh” and “Ahh” at his masterful work. Rudy Nebres’ inks were amazing too. Marvel was superhero comics mostly… so, this fantasy work caught everyone’s eye… and imagination.
Q: Do you have any good embarrassing or funny stories about my father?
Nothing specific… again, probably because I didn’t really get to hang out in the offices after hours. But I can say that your Dad was a bold and boisterous presence and a hinge pin to the daily operation of the bullpen. Though sarcasm was his weapon of choice, he was always open to experimenting to produce new stat or camera techniques, he involved himself in many unique ways to benefit the books: technical drawings, photography, typography, writing, brainstorming, etc… and he always gave his all to provide the necessary materials, often above and beyond his duties, to keep the editorial and production departments buzzing.
Q: What’s your favorite post Marvel project? I have to ask because just googling your name brings up a dozen names I recognize. I could easily have owned one of your Pokemon drawing books as a kid.
I have been fortunate to have been involved with so many different properties and projects… my ability to mimic styles has led to some strange anomalies. I’ve done Peppermint Rose and Stinkblasters. Betty Boop and Sonic the Hedgehog. Berenstain Bears and Fairly Odd Parents. Sesame Street and Nickelodeon at the same time. Once, I was published by Highlights for Children and Playboy in the same month. I had no idea what Pokemon was when I did my first How-to-Draw Pokemon book for Troll Publishing… but it soon dominated the cartoon world!
But, all-in-all, I have to say that my recent endeavors in self-publishing have been the most fun. After years of being told what to draw, I finally get to draw what I like… and I’m very proud that my artistic talents… and my production experience at Marvel and Defiant… have given me the tools and knowledge to do it. They may not sell well… I have very little time or experience to market them… but I think they’re professional and very special… and their pages will outlive me to become my legacy.
Q: Is there anywhere our readers can find you on social media or otherwise to keep up with you?
Sorry…. I used to be on Facebook, but only for close friends and family… but I’ve just recently shut down that account anyway. I guess, just keep an eye out for my books on Amazon or drop me an email!
Fantastic stuff! Someday I really have to get Eliot to do a piece on the Marvel Softball team I keep hearing so much about. One part I want to pay special attention to is the line
“It was a very friendly work environment… and instead of stifling creativity for productivity, it promoted it. It’s the reason, I believe, that so many of Marvel’s’ top talents started out as secretaries, interns, mail clerks, bullpenners, assistants, etc.”
That is an essential part of why we have this blog. I’d put that quote on a coffee mug if we did that sort of thing around here.
Thank you, Mister Zalme!
See also, www.ronzalme.com
If anyone would like to investigate some of Ron Zalme’s published works, we have links right here.
I was in the Marvel Bullpen from 1977-1985. From time to time young fans would send us their comic strips hand-drawn on typing paper. Once we got a story from a kid who was probably about six or seven. The name of his comic was “Big Bronto and Little Bronto”. They were out maraudingin the jungle for most of the story. Little Bronto kept asking Big Bronto, “When’s lunch”? We thought this was adorable and so Ron took it upon himself to draw an actual COVER for the story on Marvel Cover Stock of these two characters, Big Bronto and the much smaller Little Bronto crashing through the primordial jungle. It was complete with Logo, Corner Box, Cover Blurbs and UPC Symbol. Little Bronto looked up quizzically at Big Bronto and asked, “When’s lunch?”. Then he sent it to the return address on the fanmail. We all would have loved to see the expression on that kid’s face when he tore open the envelope from Marvel Comics. That boy is a grown man in his late forties today and I’ll bet my best Rapidograph® pen that he has Ron’s drawing framed and hanging over the TV set in his Den. That’s the kind of guy Ron Zalme was.
Thanks Elliot and Ron for bringing me back to those magnificent Marvel years, the 70’s, when we all worked together. Ron, that you are still using the drawing table is awesome and you are still keeping old school art and production alive.
Best wishes to you both!
A great chat, bringing back great memories… and I’m sure some “Secret History” for non-staffers. Nice of Ron to mention Weirdworld. The other day I came across some photos of Ron and his (new?) bride at a National Cartoonists Society event, or Museum of Cartoon Art, I forget which, ca 1980!